Name: Navigating Policy Shifts: Strategic Actions for Grantmakers to Support Their Impact Areas
Uploaded: 2025-02-27T17:31:03.750Z
Duration: 1 h 36 s
Description: Navigating Policy Shifts: Strategic Actions for Grantmakers to Support Their Impact Areas

Transcript for "Navigating Policy Shifts: Strategic Actions for Grantmakers to Support Their Impact Areas": Hi. Hello. Good morning, everyone, and welcome to today's episode of Blackbaud twenty twenty five thought leadership webinar series. That is the first time this year I've got that right. I said 20 20 four webinar series and January's installation of this, but that's an improvement in where I will take. We're gonna begin here in just a few moments, but, I'm gonna go over a few quick housekeeping items while we're giving everybody a chance to to get logged in. So, the webinar audio is gonna be broadcast through your computer speakers or your headset if you're using those. So hopefully, you can all hear me. And if you need captions, you can hover over the stage and click on the CC button on the bottom of the screen to turn the captions on and off. If you encounter any audio or technical issues like the slides freezing, we don't have too many of those today, but if our video feeds freeze or something like that, usually just a quick refresh on your browser is gonna be the best way to get things working again. Worst case scenario, you can sort of leave, log out, log back in, and that takes care of about 99% of any issues you might have. You can click on the q and a on the top right to submit any questions that you have. And we've carved out some time at the end to get to those. So never fear if you put them in and we don't answer them right away. We haven't forgotten about you. And please make sure to make those questions as specific as you can if there's a particular speaker you wanna address them to or a topic so that we can, answer those in the best possible way. We have a great team in the background who will also answering questions, as we go along if they're, you know, maybe not as germane to what we're talking about today. Next to the q and a, you'll see some documents there. You can click through those now or later, to access several links and resources that are peripheral to or corollary to this conversation today that we thought you might be interested in. You can adjust the settings by using the cogwheel at the bottom of the event space. And finally, you can use the tabs at the top of the event space to see today's agenda and meet your speakers. And also, I always like to point out that everybody's gonna get an email in about twenty four hours with a link to a recording of today's presentation, as well as their document resources, will be in there as well. So feel free to take notes as we go along, but don't feel like you gotta write down everything you hear because you're gonna get a copy of it afterwards and you'll be able to go back and check that out. Alright. So welcome everyone to today's, presentation. My name is Ray Borkman, and I'm on the marketing team here, at Blackbaud under the grant making umbrella. I'll be introducing you to the folks we're gonna talk to and you really wanna hear from here shortly, but I'm a white person who identifies as male. I use he him pronouns. I am I used to be 47 years old. Now I'm 48 years old as of last week. I have, no hair, bald head, a gray beard. I'm wearing a maroon and white checked shirt, and I am in the, loft office of my, home here, which is in Charleston, South Carolina, which is located on the native lands of the Etowah, Kiowa, Edisto, Santee, and Wasamassa people. So I'm gonna go through just a super quick introduction to Blackbaud for those of you who may not be as familiar with us. You know, Blackbaud is our sponsor for this. They're paying the bills, so I like to just give them a quick shout out or give us a quick shout out. That's who I work for. We're the world's leading, cloud software company for powering social good. And a couple years back, we celebrated our fortieth anniversary. So we serve nonprofits, educational institutions, local governments, and all sorts of entities across the social good sector by providing tailored solutions that are designed for the needs of all types of non commercial organizations. So that includes software, technology services, data intelligence, and of course, our expertise across all of our solutions that range from financial management to fundraising. And of course, our sponsor solution for today's webinar, Blackbaud Grantmaking. So your organization could be managing, your, grantmaking efforts in a variety of ways. Right? Manual spreadsheets, paper based review processes, multiple software systems doing a variety of tasks. But Blackbaud grant making is built on a powerful core that provides all the that integrates all the components that you might need to successfully reach your giving and funding mission in one streamlined solution. Alright. So our modern and secure technology whoop. I got ahead of myself there. Sorry. Tailored design means that you don't have to concern yourself with features that you may not use. Now if you'd be interested in learning more about Blackbaud grant making, we don't want to waste any of your time, any of our speakers' time talking about that today. So we do have a couple of folks who are operating, in our chat area. So first of all, Miranda, if you wanna come on stage, and you can say hello quickly. There is a you can chat with Miranda directly in the, messages up there where the q and a and the documents are. And, you can also, find in that document section a direct link to schedule a meeting with her if you'd like. Miranda, would you like to say hello? Hey, y'all. I am happy to be here today. If you guys have any follow-up questions or you'd like to be connected with anyone to learn a little bit more about grant making, feel free to message me or email me, and I can get you connected. And alongside, Miranda today, we also have Daniel who is essentially operating in the same role. I think it's the first time maybe he's jumped on one of these, webinars like this. So he's kinda there as well also to help you with any questions you might have and help us with the chat questions. Daniel? Hello? Alright. Excellent. So, I am going to go ahead now and, get into the meat and potatoes of what we're here to talk about today. So the first things first, I wanna pass the ball to each of our presenters to allow them to introduce themselves so we can get into our, panel discussion. So, Kristina, would you like to go first? Sure. Thank you so much, Ray, and thanks to you and the whole Blackbaud team for pulling this together. I'm excited for this conversation today. My name's Kristina Wertz. I use sheher pronouns. I'm currently the VP of external affairs at GEO, which I count myself as extremely lucky to be in that role. I just love it. I've been working, in The U in this weird little corner of the nonprofit world of philanthropic serving organizations for about fifteen years now. I think I was previously at Funders for LGBTQ issues, and have a background in LGBT, civil rights law and advocacy, and really appreciate being a part of this conversation. I'm calling in from, my home in the Hudson Valley Of New York, which is, originally inhabited by the Stockbridge Munsee Band of the Mohicans. Excellent. Excellent. Thank you, Kristina. And by the way, you reminded me. Anybody who wants to jump in the chat and tell us where you're tuning in from today, we'd love to hear where everybody's coming from. And with that, Daniel, I'll pass the ball to you to introduce yourself. Great. Thank you so much. Good morning, everybody. Wherever you are, good afternoon. I'm Daniel Alberttis. I'm the managing director for advisory services at Quantic Impact. We are a global advisory consulting firm focused on The Americas. Mainly right now, I'm calling in from, my home in South America, in Colombia, actually, on the native lands of my ancestors as well. And so it's kind of interesting hearing the indigenous, footprints that we're all in. And, my background's actually came from the corporate banking world and working with large foundations and nonprofits across the country. And then I transitioned into consulting and advising, spent ten years as trustee at a major philanthropic foundation, traveling, learning, doing everything, and now advise some of the largest foundations and corporations across, North, South, And Central America on their giving and creating the shift from what I call siloed impact into proper collaborations and creating Quantic Impact across their territories. Outstanding. So I've gotten the message that a few people are having trouble with the chat. Never fear. This has happened in the past. If you're not able to use the chat, just refresh your browser, and that'll that'll make it work, 99% of the time. Alright. Excellent. Well, thanks, y'all. I am going to, jump into some questions that I've prepared for you today. So I'm excited, to get into this. It's an interesting time. Right? And and I think on that note to start with, the first thing is, you know, we're we're there's there's a lot of hand wringing and consternation about what's gonna happen next. And I think there's people who can, you you know, some people will take a a a different, perspective on that. Right? Maybe what's next matters. Maybe what's next does matter. Right? Sometimes, we feel like hand wringing can be a bit, pointless. And, but sometimes it's important to analyze, you know, strategies. So the question is, does what next really matter? Or is it just a source of anxiety? Or I e, are we submitting ourselves to the gaslighting by consternating over what, you know, crazy thing might be on the horizon? Or or is that a valuable exercise? And, I'll let either one of you who wants to go first first unless you want me to call on somebody. Kristina, if you wanna go first. Sure. I'd be happy to. Thanks, Daniel. I think it's a it's a great question. I think the actions of the last few weeks have left us all a little bit traumatized and head spinning. And so it is easy to go to that place of, you know, what what hits are coming next. You know, the attacks on DEI, the federal funding freeze, the cancellation of literally life saving international aid at a scale that is hard to even imagine the extent of that dismantling. It all it all shows us the lengths in which the administration is willing to go right now. And I think that that's the hard part. But the underlying reality is we know what the goals are here. Right? We know that there's a goal to dismantle a strong civil society that makes up a thriving democracy. So we know that there's this effort to roll back, you know, decades of efforts to counteract centuries of white supremacy, to demonize people that are supporting historically marginalized communities. Like, we know that that that's, the underlying basis of what the administration is trying to do right now. And I think that that puts us back in a place of being needing to root in our values. We do need to be ready. Yes. We need to be ready, by being strong in our values, by being consistent in our work, by being unfaltering in what we stand for. And at the same time, we can't go chasing every, like, flaming object. I was trying to think of you know, there's this idea of one of the challenges in in philanthropy is funders chasing shiny objects or whatever's next. Right now, it kind of feels like the opposite of, like, chasing flaming objects. Like, what is currently, the biggest challenge? So I I caution against that and instead thinking about the underlying truths of both what, administration that has made clear the lengths they're willing to go to, what, what their underlying role is, and then what the underlying role of philanthropy and nonprofits, which is ultimately to support thriving communities in my mind, you know, what our values are. Yeah. I've been I've been saying a lot lately, you know, hope for the best, but prepare for the worst. Right? And so, as we look at where we are right now and what tomorrow comes, I think for those of us that were aware of project 2025, maybe, you know, even a couple of years ago, there's a blueprint here. Right? And philanthropy is heavily involved in that blueprint. And the way I see it is, you know, at the end of the day, I think we're up to, like, almost a third of the the expected goals of the project are being fulfilled. And so we can hope for the best, but I think we have to prepare that the agenda's kind of flowing and it's going. And, you know, the more they shift into having more control and eliminating certain positions, the more deregulation that happens, the more chaos that exists, I think it's gonna be easier and easier for that agenda to kinda come forth. And so, you know, I'm I'm in the position right now that we have to learn from the the the the sector within, you know, the the philanthropic industrial complex, you know, to use Kristina term, of what happened and how that was, you know, monetized and put into power to put us in the position that we're in. And I think it's time that the rest of philanthropy that sees and hopes differently can come together to actually have conversations that make sense for us and creates the plans that we need to at the at the at the very least mitigate the impact and and come up with a countering mechanism for whatever's gonna happen. Because I see the next, three or ten year years being really dramatic to the sector, especially at the international level with the USAID, you know, funding freeze. That's gonna be very difficult to kinda come back from at a global level. And I know, you know, this is mostly a US foundation space. Me that cover, you know, Central And South America, the impact here is is is huge to what's gonna happen there. And not sure who's gonna be there to pick up those pieces, to be honest. Yeah. We're gonna we're gonna touch on that a little bit more in a follow-up question that I have. So we'll drill into that in a little bit more detail in a bit. Big, you know, buzzword that's floated around the foundation space for the last couple of years is is capacity building, right, and and what funders can do to facilitate that. I think, now more than ever, that seems to be important. I mean, can either of you speak to, like, the importance of prioritizing capacity building for, funders grantees as we move forward in this? Kristina, you wanna jump on that first? Yeah. Sure. I'm happy to. And, you know, capacity building is something that's part of the backbone of what we, encourage here at GEO, in terms of what makes good grant making and the kind of support that you can, provide to grantees. You know, I'll first say that many grantees right now are really struggling and are underwater. And sometimes capacity building efforts can feel like pressure, and feel like an additional add on, if if it doesn't come if it's not generated from grantees themselves. So I'd say the first step is is reaching out to your grantees and asking them what they need. And and actually that's not even the first step. The first step is having, like, the healthy, trust based relationship to be able to reach out and get an honest answer back about what they actually need. And then the second step is to follow through on that, to to figure out ways, to move forward in supporting things that are actually needed rather than, you know, what, you know, some strategists at a foundation may have thought are needed without being in direct conversation with grantees. So I think I think that's an important backdrop. And then from there, in terms of what we're hearing from GEO members right now, in that as part of that feedback loop from grantees is folks are doing amazing support around legal assistance, particularly legal defense shoring up and making sure people understand risk, that they've got, eyes wide open in the risks that they're taking and that they're able to weather lawsuits should they come their way, capacity building around, like, really basic security needs. You know, there's the administration itself and then there's those who are being empowered by the administration. And there is a scary threat of violence out there right now, especially as we're thinking about folks with intersecting identities, queer and trans folks, people that are doing, you know, BIPOC specific work. So real sec like security, both digital security and physical security, personal security for leaders of organizations, purchasing services for grantees, things like scenario planning, financial housekeeping, you know, helping folks get their, get their houses in order to be really protected from various kinds of attacks on an organization. And then I'll say, you know, I could, like, I could go on and on about types of capacity building, but another one I just wanna lift up specifically is around wellness support and psychological support for, for grantees right now, and particularly for leaders whose own identities put them at risk. You know, it's it's hard to be a leader right now, and support for folks to weather the storm feels really important. Yeah. That's I think the mental the social emotional, aspect is huge. I think you raise that next month. There's a really interesting, webinar on that as well. So, you know, we'll segue to that. But, listen, my my I spent a lot of time in the capacity building space, you know, raised millions of dollars across the country for capacity building. And and I'm gonna be honest that I think from a funder space, in many ways, it's kind of this shotgun approach to just giving someone a little bit of something to kinda get there. But, you know, what I'm seeing right now is because the levels of stress and anxiety and, uncertainty in the space right now, you know, learning and and trying to grasp, you know, for whatever is out there is very difficult right now. And so I've I've been hearing a lot of funders say, hey. What can we do in the capacity building space? And I approach this a lot with the technology and the AI kind of, you know, current mode that we add in terms of being able to gather data, number one, and then analyze data. And so I operate under what I call the chronic impact formula, you know, for success. And to me, it's kinda simple. It's it's impact to me is resources times collaboration to what I call the power of a shared vision. And when we don't have enough in in communities, at least in geography, Geographic communities, call it a county, is this shared vision for what everyone needs, everyone wants, what everyone is going through. And it's kinda sad. And and what I look at a lot is that it's very difficult to prescribe capacity building, to Kristina point, without really understanding what the need actually is and what prescription is needed for each different organization. Because you can't come in and be like, here's one platform for volunteering that works for everybody. Here's one platform for, you know, AI that helps everybody because everyone's unique. You know, it's like a premier athlete that needs customized nutrition to get them to that next level because their genes and their body and their DNA are kinda like that. And so I kinda take a step backwards first, which is kind of understanding, you know, I think the biggest gap that exists is this kind of gulf of, ignorance that we have in a community, which is the level of information from a trustee at a funder that has, you know, been very successful, raises money, donates, whatever they do. The level of information or education they have about their particular community's needs versus the person at the nonprofit at the ground level doing the work. I mean, usually getting $10.12, $13 in an hour or whatever it's gonna be. You know? If you look at the layers to get from the person, you know, handing the sandwich out to the homeless or doing the work to get to management, to their executives, to their board, to the foundation, to the funder. Until we get to a place of being able to give the voiceless the voice so that funders can actually come together, have data to analyze, and then work collaboratively, then we can prescribe capacity building, I think, in a much more laser focused approach where every grantee gets exactly what they need, and we are there now. We can't say we don't have the resources. We can't say we don't have the technology. All we really need is just someone to kinda come together and say, why are we not doing this right now? Yeah. Yeah. No. That's that's true. And as the guy who works for the tech company. Right? All that the the data, you know, exists. I did, drop that, link for the webinar that, Daniel referenced, the registration page for that in the chat. For those of you who, are familiar with Mikko Marquette Whitlock, he's long time been a friend of the program. He, calls himself the mindful techie. And we have, he's done in the past a lot of well-being and mindfulness work for us for funding organizations. What we asked him to do this time was, get out into the field a little bit, do some interviews with some grantees, as well as some funders. But some grantees to interview them and talk to them about what are you experiencing right now, what's giving you stress. Right? And and in research, right, they I don't know whose quote this is, but, right, the research, you know, actually becomes interesting when you say, oh, I I wasn't expecting that. Right? That's the moment. And I think, Mico has had a few moments where there's all the things that all of us could sit here and talk about. Right? Like, what would be, we would, you know, we could, you know, provide, you know, multiyear funding, things like that. Like, we all know what some of the prescriptive things you can do to support that. But when you actually hear from funded organizations what their experience is, you learn something new. So I encourage, any of you to check that out as part of this. And then, I'm gonna bring up a little sorry. Daniel, did you have a corollary? I just wanted to kinda highlight to Kristina point about the the funding social emotional well-being is I'm I'm hearing a lot and a lot of concerns around the levels of burnout amongst nonprofit CEOs and senior executives. The ones that, you know, call it from 02/2007, '2 thousand '8 recession through the first Trump administration, through COVID, through I mean, South Florida, you know, the hurricanes we've kind of been through across that, the natural disasters to now people are tired. They're burnt out. And my biggest concern is we start losing, you know, people in their early to mid fifties just because they can't anymore. Who's stepping in to take over these big responsibilities that has the experience, that has the fortitude, and more importantly, has the resiliency that I think our generation kinda grew up with and was was kinda cut with, you know, in terms of that. And so funding social, emotional well-being, I think, is extremely powerful right now and and productive. Absolutely. Absolutely. I think that's I think that's a great point, Daniel. And I feel like part of what we're seeing right now is a bit of a slower response from both the nonprofit sector and the philanthropic sector that we saw at, like, the height of COVID or the twenty sixteen election or the racial justice uprisings in 2020, '20 '20 '1. It seems like it's been a little bit of a slower pace. And about a month ago, I was feeling really frustrated. Like, what's going on? Where's philanthropy? You know, we're folks aren't stepping up. And now I I am feeling a shift. Like, Like, it does feel a little bit more like, okay. You know, maybe part of the issue is around communication or like folks aren't necessarily sharing what they're doing or everyone's, just like doing the work more than talking about it. But I think that institutions are doing really amazing stuff right now and it's just it's taken a little bit longer because we're tired. I think that's a big part of it, you know? And so that, like, that, like, support like, both pacing. Right? It's part of it goes back to that not chasing the flaming object. Right? Pacing, staying, steadfast and consistent, and also making sure that we're supporting, like, that social emotional health of our people. And it really really quick on that because I do a lot of disaster relief work as well. You know, there's this kind of concept that the storm is passed and then the relief efforts come in. Right? This storm is just overhead for the next four years. Right? And so there's a level of despair out there, which is, you know, we can't even begin the rebuilding process because we're still kinda hunkering down, you know, getting beaten by the wind or whatever the storm is gonna be. And and I kind of see that feeling energetically amongst the people that I talk to, which is just I'm I'm holding on to the roof of whatever I can so I don't get swept away, but I don't know how long I can do this for. Then that's concerning. Yeah. Yeah. And I I you know, towards the end of, like, communicating, like, sort of the impact, anyone on who's listening in who has to, need to talk about this would like some some evidence. You know? Both of you actually shared with me the Urban Institute, page that I am going to, pull up. That is in the documents section of the, of the, module up there on the top. But I will try to share that really quickly if I can figure out how to just to kinda show people what it looks like. And while I'm doing that, if either of you have any just comments on it while I'm I'll I'll talk through it really quick. It's for you for you, but it's a tool to just analyze, again, data. Right? They just took all the September, I think, from 2021, '20 '20 '2 and and kinda just segregated out what who had received government funding. And they built this really nice interactive map of the country where you can, you know, focus in at the state level, the county level, and the congressional district level, and find out exactly how much money, you know, that region receives from the government. Obviously, you know, not all of it is is, on the line for being cut, but it does give you a really good idea and glimpse of how much money, the government does give grant wise. And I think the number was something crazy where, they give, like, three or four times yearly what the total assets of philanthropy are for the country, which is mind boggling if you think about that. Yes. The, this was yeah. Here's this this thing that, you know, really struck me is this third paragraph. In all but two of the 437 congressional districts in The United States, a typical nonprofit could not cover its expenses without its government grants. And in every state, between 6080% of nonprofits that receive government grants would be at risk of a financial shortfall. So this is a this is linked in the, document section as I mentioned. And, and, so please, feel free to check that out. And then I'm gonna move to our next question. I there we go. And I have a visual to go along with this as well. So, really, what I wanna call out is this, over here to the right, because I just I find this to be very powerful. Right? $6,750,000,000,000 is the US federal government spends. Right? And the this says the entire, the total value of all private and community foundation assets in The United States equals 1,466,000,000,000.000. Right? So this just gives you a a picture of the scope. And then I included this quote just because I think, it was Pete Grant making who shared this, quote from Jim. So hopefully, he doesn't mind. But, this was I just thought was a really interesting, quote about that ties in with this question, which is about, you know, why should communication be a critical part of our path moving forward? And, Daniel, I'll start with you since, I started with Kristina last time. It's it's interesting. I think it just really comes down to, you know, this removal of ignorance in so many ways. Right? And I was I was listening to, the Stupinski Foundation podcast today talking about, you know, inequality, in in the in the in the country and the huge miscommunication factor that's happening of people believing things. You know, just yesterday alone, there was a ton of tweets going out, people saying that the house had passed the bills, removing taxes on Social Security, Medicare, over time and and tips. Right? And it wasn't the case, but, you know, we don't get to a place of having, the the the big majority of uneducated, you know, people that didn't go to college that are voters, that are just, you know, trusting TikTok, trusting social media, trusting influencers, bots in many cases, you know, countries that are, you know, against what we're trying to do for a united, you know, country. I think communication is really at the core, but the question comes down to is, do you trust who you're listening to? You know, how do you trust, you know, where the message is coming from? Because I'll go back to it again. We are where we are because of the Heritage Foundation and Project twenty twenty five and about a 50 other funders and nonprofits that came together. That was a voice being communicated by philanthropy. And it moved, you know, 80,000,000 people to vote in a certain way. And so before communication starts, I think it's that aspect of how do you build trust and how do you find the voices that you can actually resonate with to be able to kind of create that shared vision that I was talking about earlier? Yeah. I think that's right, Anthony. And I think that kind of in some ways, I mean, it's dark, but that sort of funder organizing and collaborative mobilization that we saw to make 2025 project 2025 happen is somewhat inspiring of what could be, if there is a real concerted effort among philanthropy that is actually wanting to support thriving nonprofits and communities. And so, yeah, I really I I appreciate that point, Daniel. You know, when I think about the importance of communication, to me, it comes to a couple of points. One, the, like, cultural influence of philanthropy, the strength that we have in our numbers, that what it means when we have a united sector to stand for something. I think there's a lot of power there. I'm also thinking about the the point that I made earlier where with when institutions don't feel empowered to communicate the steps that they're taking, whether it be directly to their grantees or to the sector as a whole, it feels like there's a gap. And folks feel, I think, a extra layer of insecurity. You know, funders are deeply important to nonprofits when they're worried that they're gonna lose their funding or that funders aren't gonna be there to help, you know, be a drop in the ocean to try to make up for this gap in federal funding. Like I wanna be clear about that, but nonetheless, like a really important, effort to support their work, when institutions feel like that's not gonna be there, it's even more destabilizing than this than everything that that we're feeling. Like, if your friends aren't there, the people that you trust aren't there. It's it's really scary. So there's there's a real importance around communication of, making sure like directly with grantees, they understand that you're there. And then on the sector level, you know, that philanthropy is still here, that we are making moves to support our communities, and that we're willing to assume some risk and join the fight, right, and not just be and it, like, the, and not, like, engage in anticipatory compliance before these things are settled. Yeah. I'll add one more thing, which to me, you know, proper communication strategy, you know, begins with a really good deep analysis of your audience and your market, right, and and who that is gonna be. And I think what was very demonstrable in the last election was the influence and the vote of the Latino, the Latino male, you know, across the country kinda shifting to vote Republican, vote Trump. And there's very little communication to the Hispanic or the Latino community. And this is what '28, '20 '9 percent of the population right now. Very diverse, very important, very powerful. I think the last, numbers I saw from the Latino Donor Collaborative, it's something like, you know, $3,000,000,000,000 in, GDP created by US Latinos and Hispanics. Tell me where philanthropy is really doing much besides maybe putting money into Hispanics and philanthropy and kind of reaching out and doing things like that. I think that's a huge opportunity where if you're gonna communicate, really understand the audience and understand, you know, what they're exactly, you know, going through and dealing with so the messaging actually resonates with that audience that much better. Yeah. It's you know, I was thinking, like, the, you know, the the based on that number that I put on the slide, what was the you know, that you could fund philanthropy for, like, forty two days or something. That's that's how much the budget would make up. So, you know, you're not gonna offset that. Right? So the, you know, we we gotta, you know, think outside the box, which is what our space has always done. Right? It's a do more with less. Right? Or do same with less. It's a a sad, sometimes, exhausting reality. But, you know, that's where the communication, that's where the togetherness, and, again, that quote that I thought Jim had was really key. Alright. Moving next. So I I guess the then this one would be this one's interesting to me. What what would you say to organizations that are concerned about the potential risk of increased oversight, audits, the threat of having, perhaps, the IRS designation removed if they don't align with the administration's policies. And, Daniel, I'll let you I I did Kristina twice in a row. So, Daniel, I'll let you go twice in a row. Yeah. We kinda I kinda joked around, yesterday preparing for this, kind of being like, well, listen. You know, the good part is if if all these federal employees are being let go and it's this era of deregulation, who's really gonna be around at the IRS to kind of, you know, revoke your your your five zero one or whatever it's gonna be. So, I I think there is a level of trepidation and a level of kind of walking cautiously, you know, in terms of what can happen. You know, there there's been, you know, comments in the past from vice president Vance on, you know, the the the power of philanthropy or maybe cutting back on what it is. I think what's gonna be interesting kinda going forward is if you have a smaller government and there's less taxing of the billionaires, then you would assume the math makes sense that there will be more billionaires with even more money. The question is, at what point will they be philanthropic? Right? At what point, you know, do they use a traditional foundation structure now, or do they use kinda what the Chan Zuckerberg initiative does with, you know, just keeping everything privately out there, which is something growing very much in the ultra high net worth market right now. So, you know, there are ways around protecting yourself from government oversight if needed through some of those, you know, private, for profit structures. And I think you're gonna start seeing a lot of that develop as, the fear kicks in as to what can or cannot happen going forward, unfortunately. Yeah. I appreciate that. I I think about I I sort of think about this question on three fronts, like, nonprofits, foundations, and then the sector as a whole. You know, for nonprofits, I really agree with what Daniel Alberttis saying, like, let's just hope, like, nobody left at the IRS is a good thing. But nonetheless, like, nonprofits need that capacity building on legal support to understand, you know, what is potentially a risk, and, like, it's capacity building around exploration of alternative structures like like Daniel Alberttis was saying. On on the foundation side, you know, generally foundations have the resource to hire the lawyers. Right? They can, pay to have someone go through all their stuff to figure figure out, you know, do we need to change the language, like all of that. And so it's important, you hire the lawyer, or, you know, have that in house general counsel. But I think there's a really important caution to not then, slip into having general counsels be de facto chief strategists, where there's legal advice is one thing and it's it's just advice. Right? You get to make the business decision, the strategic decision, the values based decision about what risks you're willing to take and what risks you don't wanna take and then that are, you know, existential to the organization. So I really encourage institutions to understand what is a strategic and values based decision, a business based decision, and what is like, okay, this is a line we can't we can't cross. Those lines are blurry. Like, with all due respect to the lawyers, I'm a recovering lawyer myself, but generally the, you know, general counsel is not the chief strategist. They have another a different important role to play at an institution. And then at the sector level, I'm really beating the drum right now about how important infrastructure organizations are to responding to the existential threat on our sector, right? Like that's what we saw, that federal funding freeze was a total panic moment because it was like, this could absolutely destroy the nonprofit sector, whether they're taking away five zero one c three status or not. And, you know, that's a bill that is gonna be brought back up again. Regardless of that, that it is clear that there is an existential threat to our sector, and it is the infrastructure organizations whose job it is to defend the sector as a whole. Right? It was we saw it was the National Council of Nonprofits that stepped up and filed a lawsuit the very next day. Really impressive leadership, really cool move by them, and, like, they need support. The the philanthropic serving organizations are the ones that are you know, it's our job to bring together a community of funders to share information, to build capacity of our sector as a whole. So just real encouragement to support infrastructure organizations where for us, it's not mission drift to do that sector level support. Right? It it it's it is a % the role of the National Council of Nonprofits to defend the nonprofit sector, whereas another institution is going to be, you know, having to detract from their direct service work, their other policy work, their other movement building and organizing work in order to do that. Yeah. The last thing I'll add to it is I think it's more about the threat of it happening happening. If you if you look at what the administration has done with tariffs, with, you know, fund defunding NATO, you know, Ukraine, all that. It's more about, hey. If you don't fall into place, you know, then these repercussions may come about. And that might be just enough for foundations. I think the the the idea is gonna be to starve the organizations that are nonconforming to the agenda that that we're trying to they're trying to accomplish, to through a process of, just leaning in a little bit onto the funder space or to the donor base to the ones that are community foundations that are raising money and, you know, having to kinda clean up their content right now or kind of, you know, create a more neutral outlook to what they're doing. And so I think the onus now goes on to the private philanthropy sector. Right? The sector where the money's already there. They're not actively fundraising. You know, they don't really have anyone to hold them accountable to. Now it's the time to, you know, invest in advocacy, invest in programs, and and policies that actually shift the narrative back because I've been hearing from a lot of foundations that raise money that, you know, one way or another, they're having to clean up their website, clean up their content just because they don't wanna upset donors in some capacity. Guess what? That those are donors, you know, re responding to the administration's agenda in some way or another. Mhmm. I think, you know, so follow-up sort of on this because we talked a lot about risk through this, and I I we we are not, you the three of us have talked about this as we were kinda planning this a little bit. I I think I mentioned this this to you. That recently someone made the argument to me, that the philanthropic space is the appropriate space for risk taking. As risk averse as we may call ourselves from time to time, that and their point to me was, the government is spending taxpayer dollars, so they can't afford that the same level of risk that private foundations can. I just I'm just curious if either of you have thoughts on that, just your your opinions. Yeah. I have I have a strong opinion. I'm sorry. Yeah. I love I love my opinions though, Kristina. I think foundations are absolutely well positioned to absorb some risk. Like, take some risk, take some hits. You know, distract from the life saving work of, direct service organizations and policy organizations, you know, use up some of that government resource paying attention to you instead of paying attention to grantees. So I really encourage foundations to understand the risk and assume the risk. And then also, you know, what you're saying about, sort of the source of the resource and the origins of the wealth, like, one of the things that we're navigating a lot with our members at GEO right now is supporting folks and talking to boards and making sure whether, you know, whether it's a family foundation that still has family on the board or an endowed foundation or a community foundation, like of all these different structures, there's often this, you know, those of us who are in the day to day trenches of philanthropy versus the folks who are on the board and are worried about their own liability and exposure. And so, you know, really making sure that boards are on board, with the values of the institution, understanding what's a values based decision that they have training and support and, you know, are navigating that line. Yeah. Listen. To me, risk is all about, you know, is is directly correlated to ignorance. Right? The the the the less you know about something, the riskier something becomes. And in in this day and age with, you know, AI and technology gathering and the way we can actually aggregate data, I mean, if it's used properly and analyzed properly, risk should be reduced to the levels where you're just comfortable. But I keep in the banking world, right, where everything was about risk in terms of us lending money or investing in many ways. And so you look at some of the research on, like, multiyear general operating grants. Right? You know, people putting out, you know, $56,000,000 over over five or six years. That's long term thinking, but the data backs it. The data backs universal bank basic income. The data backs funding general operating dollars. The data backs all these things, But it just comes down to, like, where is the level of information reaching the decision makers? And back to the board trustee aspect of it at the funder level, you know, what you have is a lot of senior executives that, you know, make great money. They're doing well, but they're still not the boss. Right? You know, it's not the owner of a of a foundation. You still have to report to, you know, ten, fifteen, 20 different people and get their buy in to shift into a different direction, whether it's impact investments, venture, philanthropy, anything kind of, like, you know, new out there. But it all comes down to education and data back training to be able to just remove the veil of ignorance from those that have the power to make these decisions. Yeah. Excellent. Good. Good. So my final question, we sorta got into, in in some of the other questions a little bit. So I'm gonna repose it just to see if there's anything either of you wanna add, on this. But we've got some QA that's come in as well, so we'll move on to those, if we need to. Go ahead. So it's the question is, you know, what's the role of funders in supporting their grantees during this time? So like I said, we touched on some of that, but any additional thoughts on that? I think there's a really important basic step here, which is the the role of foundations is to move money. Like, let's not lose sight of that in all of the other things that foundations can do as well. The capacity building of support is so important, but, like, it is about, getting money to communities and nonprofits that need it. And there's you know, we have been hearing from nonprofits for decades now of what the quality and characteristics of that money needs to be to be helpful. It's nothing new, but it's as important now as always, which is long term general operating support, multi year grants, flexible funding, you know, reducing barriers to funding, like, you know, we saw in the height of the pandemic folks, shifting to, you know, conversational or video reporting. Like, think about what the structures are and barriers at your institution and what is necessary and what can just start to fall away, you know, engage use rapid response funds, use intermediaries who are able to be perhaps more nimble than your own institution is. We've seen really cool news in the last couple of days about foundations increasing their payout. McArthur Foundation just announced they're increasing their payout, and that's that's a big one. There's there's cultural influence there, using discretionary funds, using bridge loans. Like, just keep the money flowing in whatever creative way that you can. Yeah. I you know, to me, it's interesting because I think not every foundation is the same. Right? You have you have foundations at 50,000,000, some at half a billion, and then you have the the billion plus, you know, all the way to, like, you know, the Robert Wood Johnson's and and those kind of levels. And I always have said and and and thought that at the larger level, you know, the ones with the multibillion dollars that are are doing grant making, but if they understood the power of actually investing in the statewide or the community wide philanthropic sector itself just from the aspect of funding the PSOs. Right? Funding the geofunders, funding the state associations so that it's not just an annual state conference, but now it's more about South Florida, for example, where I am as a region, and having much more collaboration amongst the three counties in South Florida. And that happens all over the country. Right? And so I think there's a there's an avenue for, again, back to collecting data, analyzing data, understanding what's really happening. But there needs to be money put into the hubs of which the other foundations play a role. Because, you know, a smaller, even hundred million dollar foundation is not gonna give to the sector itself, but the billion dollars 1 can. And I really believe there's an opportunity there to kind of use that bigger capital to create structures in which the smaller ish foundations can actually give smarter in their communities and collaborate more effectively. Mhmm. Kristina, you'll take that. Right? If you guys get a a $20,000,000 grant at GEO to do this I'm not gonna say that. I'm gonna say that. I'm gonna say that. I'm all over it. You know? And and and I love there's nothing I love more than a good segue. So, I'm gonna air up our first, question here and read it for you. Are there any newsletters or associations you would recommend following? Stay on top of news regarding federal funding changes. And, Kristina, I know you'll be familiar. I'll let you start. Yeah, sure. I think, the the I mentioned them before. The National Council of Nonprofits has done an incredible job tracking executive orders that are affecting the nonprofit sector. And they've got a resource on their website that charts out the current executive orders and the implications of them and the current legal status and challenges. So really recommend that. I can pull up a link in a minute. And then, you know, we're doing our best at at GEO as well to, continue to offer guidance to our members our members and really the philanthropic community at large, so highly recommend signing up for our for our newsletter. And you know, if you're in a regional association of grant makers, it's also really important I think to stay in the loop on what's happening in your state and in your particular locality because there's a lot of really cool organizing happening there too, and local governments, shifting around their funding structures as well to make up for some of this gap. Mhmm. Yeah. I'm a I'm a big AI guy. Right? And so to me, it's more about having information, you know, at my fingertips, ASAP. And so the perplexities, the chat g p t that can go online and literally pull information that just hit the the Internet or the wire in some capacity. And the reason I like it is because I can then follow-up and say, okay. This happened. You know? Well, how does it affect my organization? How does it affect what I do? And the AI will be smart enough to actually give you customized feedback and answers based on that. And if you're a nonprofit, you can turn that into a fundraising opportunity. If you're a funder, you could use it for strategic planning or at least starting conversations with your network. Mhmm. And for me personally, I can't call out every single one of the wonderful regional PSOs that I have relationships with around the country. So I'm just gonna mention a handful of the national ones that we work with regularly that I think are doing fantastic work and will have great information on this, like PEAT Grantmaking, Exponent Philanthropy, and TAG, which is the Technology Association of Grantmakers. All three of those groups, are national groups and they're doing fantastic work. And they're sort of correct for different sizes and focuses of organizations. So if you wanted to research those and kind of figure out, which ones or all of them are are most appropriate for you. I'd also add really quick is LinkedIn. Right? I mean, I get most of my news and and connections on that, and and we connect it on LinkedIn as well. And so follow the right people, and and you're gonna kind of be at the cutting edge of what's happening out there right now. Yep. Yep. And, the speakers tab above will allow you to find all of our, LinkedIn profiles and and, and connect to them if you're if you'd like to. Alright. Next one here. How would you recommend staff members to encourage leadership who might be more risk averse to not pre comply with policy changes? Who went first last time? Kristina, Daniel, alright. You're going first. This is a tough one. And I've I've got a I got a lot of this. You know, I, I mentor a lot of BIPOC Foundation staff, you know, in the in the earlier years of their career and, you know, millennials and Gen Zs, they're very they're very vocal, they're very passionate for what they wanna do, and and and they hate it, you know, injustice and oppression and all these different things. But at the same time, they understand, you know, career ladder and and growing and and and not risking, you know, a really good job at a at a at a foundation. And so to me, it's it all just comes down to, you know, having honest conversations and building that level of trust with your boss, whoever that boss may be, and understanding that it's not a traditional for profit business where, you know, they are the CEO. The executive director, that CEO reports to a board of directors, and that board is going to have a level of information that'll help them decide on what policies they have to do. And, unfortunately, it's happened many times. You kinda have to go with the way things are and, you know, state your case as as, professionally as you can. But unfortunately, sometimes, you know, when it comes to the bigger picture of those, you know, raising funds and and, bringing dollars in, it's it's about open conversations with those that may oppose your views. Kristina, anything to add there? Go ahead. Yeah. A couple quick thoughts to add. I mean, I think we think about this a lot at GEO. What does it actually take to make change at different levels of an organization? And what does change management leadership look like? How do you actually, you know, steer the ship of a foundation, when there's so many layers and folks, operating at, you know, touching different parts of the elephant. That was a lot of mixed metaphors. So, you know, one thing just to if if you'll indulge me, a little plug for, some of our programming work, I'll put it into I guess I'll put it into the chat. We offer peer communities and cohorts where you can come together with folks that have similar functions to you at an at your organization or are working at a sim similar level to work through some of the issues that you're facing. And we find that, you know, that sort of community collaboration, peer to peer, information sharing can really help people dislodge some of the barriers that they're facing. So I just put in a link to some of our, peer communities and cohorts to explore. And then, you know, another, I don't mean to be so shameless in the plugs, but I really do believe in the power of of PSOs, philanthropy serving organizations, to frankly provide some cover, in an institution where you you can, you know, share some of the resources from any of, any of the PSOs that might be resonating with, the leadership of your institution to show, like, hey. This is the trend. This is the direction that things are going. If you took this step, you wouldn't be alone. Right? Like, there's other people out there talking about this. One of the biggest challenges in philanthropy is people working in isolation. And the more folks feel connected, whether it's through, you know, peer communities and actual cohorts of people working together or even just resources, and communications, the the more that folks can feel that they're part of a larger network. Excellent. I know we're getting close to the noon hour on the East Coast because my cat, Juan Humberto, is, circling around me asking why his feeder hasn't gone off, which always happens about this time. But it's good because we've got one question, remaining. I'll share that, and, we should be in good shape. So what are some ways we can mobilize to advocate for policy changes? Oh, I have to pick somebody. I'll I'll go for this one. I mean, listen to me, it comes back down to that shared vision. Right? If you don't have a shared vision on what you want that policy to change to be, I mean, it's really about creating a movement. Right? It's it's really about getting the the people in position which are voters, which are, you know, young people, which are, you know, donors to come together. But if you don't really understand what everyone wants to do and this country does not have a shared vision in any kind of capacity, Right now, I think it starts with that, and then having that, you know, rallying cry around why these things make sense, and meeting people where they are. I'm doing a lot of work on TikTok right now because that is where our young generation is, getting their information, getting their education right now, and philanthropy is just not there. And so I think we have this huge disconnect between, you know, highly intelligent, you know, sector people on LinkedIn, and then, you know, millions and millions on, TikTok that are deciding, you know, what their policies should be based on misinformation in so many ways. Mhmm. Yeah. And I'd also say, you know, good old fashioned political organizing, right? Reach out to your local representatives. Foundations have a lot of power in local communities and a lot of influence and, you know, a local elected getting a call from a foundation president that has a lot of influence in that region can be a very powerful thing. So don't be afraid to engage in advocacy. I think advocacy can be a scary word in the five zero one c three and foundation world, but don't forget like that, you know, Alliance for Justice is a great resource to, get some training, and materials on where are the lines between lobbying and non lobbying, advocacy. There's a lot that foundations and nonprofits can still do. So don't be afraid to dip your toe into that into that world too. Absolutely. Excellent. And I'll leave you with this from the very young on TikTok to the very old like me. Some of you will remember this man, who was an unlikely, representative of the sentiment based on the television show that he did. But this is the important thing for all of us to remember right now. I think about this every day. Right? Take care of yourselves and each other. That's what we've gotta do as we're going through, some of what we're experiencing right now. Former mayor of Cincinnati, I think. Jerry Springer. Anyway, I wanna thank, both of you, Kristina, Daniel, so much today. If we didn't get to any of your questions, we can email you back with a response. So keep going on that. And, and, please let us know if you're interested in learning more about Blackbaud grant making. And last reminder that everyone will get a copy of today's presentation, an email with a link to that in about twenty four hours, so that you can, share this with your colleagues if you like or review anything that you might have missed along the way, option to schedule a call, and, of course, all these wonderful resources that we've referenced in the presentation. Kristina, Daniel, thank you so much. Yeah. Thank you. Great to be in conversation with you both. Thanks so much, Ray. Thank you. Have a great day. Have a great week. Take care.